Bamboo rod newbie- what should I expect?

[henkverhaar]

Thanks, good to know. I understand that "true carp" you are referring to would be more "fat" for its body length.

Among other things, yes. Different mouth shape, different dorsal fin shape, an more.

[Eddie Southgate]

PS: I have to repeat. For a versatile rod I want it to be able to cast weighted flies, such as weighted nymphs, streamers, and wooly buggers. Not a pure dry fly rod.

Would this affect my choice on the rod taper? I read many bamboo rods, especially those small creek models, are said to be designed with dry fly taper.

What kind of water do you fish the most ? What size flies ? Pick a length and line weight that suits that . An 8' 5-6 weight rod is my choice for bigger water and most fishing in tailwaters around here . When I go to the Smokey Mountain area or western North Carolina I usually fish a 7' 6" 4 or 5 wt with a DT line as most of the water I fish there is small to medium.

Coming from graphite you might like the Dickerson tapers made by Art Weiler or AJ Thramer , both could be bought lightly used at about what you have budgeted. My favorite Weiler rod is a copy of the Garrison 212 and throws either 5wt or 6wt DT lines , one as well as the other . It fishes all the fly types you mentioned with ease and is usually the rod I have when I am not sure what a days fishing is gonna amount to .

Any of the older Orvis rods would also be a good choice and can usually be bought reasonably priced , I own four and count them among the rods I would never sell . Their new rods are overpriced in my opinion and are not near as interesting to me as their older rods . Joe Brooks fished Orvis rods .

Eddie

[Eddie Southgate]

To the OP - It seems to me you will be only occasionally if not rarely be using a bamboo rod. Assuming i'm correct and you are accustomed to and prefer fast graphite, even moderate graphite is fast compared to most if not all bamboo. I recommend not rushing to purchase something, personally I don't think you will enjoy an older Orvis as they are on the slow side. I would look for a rod based on Per Brandin tapers or a Dickerson taper, especially a Dickerson 8014 or even better a Dickerson 8014 Guide which will cast just about anything from small dries to large streamers, and you shouldn't have to adjust your cast drastically to make a good enjoyable cast.

I'm not being a wise guy here...I'd really like to know. Who makes, or made, a rod in those tapers that would sell for anywhere near the OP's ballpark budget?

Art Weiler and AJ Thramer for starters . AJ's rods can be found on Carmines web site for that and less , he has several listed now . Arts rods are not much more than his budget when bought new from Art and used are usually under $700 . AJ is not making new rods but Art is and usually has his most popular rods in stock .Carmina also currently has several of his rods listed . If I wanted a new Dickerson 8014 Guide I would call Art and spend a couple hundred more on a brand new rod . https://www.artweiler.com/

https://jordan-millsrodco.com/catalog The Thramer rods are now mostly sold as are the Weiler's but he has one of Art's Payne 202's in the $700 range.

[DonT]

What Eddie said... You can't go wrong with the Dickerson tapers. No boo rod is going to feel like the faster graphite rods but you can push the Dickerson tapers without them complaining or your loops collapsing.....7'6" to 8' is the sweet spot for me. I'm not a fan of the long older solid rods, with the exception of the Payne and Leonard 8'6" dry fly tapers. Those are amazing with the right line and a relaxed stroke. The good boo rods will feel way different in your hand because of the weight distributions but they are pretty forgiving and throw tight loops with ease. The only downside I've experienced with 5 and 6 weight boo rods is is picking up a lot of line from heavy current to start the backcast, no bamboo rod has the backbone of graphite for doing this. Good luck.

[G-ManBart]

To the OP - It seems to me you will be only occasionally if not rarely be using a bamboo rod. Assuming i'm correct and you are accustomed to and prefer fast graphite, even moderate graphite is fast compared to most if not all bamboo. I recommend not rushing to purchase something, personally I don't think you will enjoy an older Orvis as they are on the slow side. I would look for a rod based on Per Brandin tapers or a Dickerson taper, especially a Dickerson 8014 or even better a Dickerson 8014 Guide which will cast just about anything from small dries to large streamers, and you shouldn't have to adjust your cast drastically to make a good enjoyable cast.

I'm not being a wise guy here...I'd really like to know. Who makes, or made, a rod in those tapers that would sell for anywhere near the OP's ballpark budget?

Art Weiler and AJ Thramer for starters . AJ's rods can be found on Carmines web site for that and less , he has several listed now . Arts rods are not much more than his budget when bought new from Art and used are usually under $700 . AJ is not making new rods but Art is and usually has his most popular rods in stock .Carmina also currently has several of his rods listed . If I wanted a new Dickerson 8014 Guide I would call Art and spend a couple hundred more on a brand new rod . https://www.artweiler.com/

https://jordan-millsrodco.com/catalog The Thramer rods are now mostly sold as are the Weiler's but he has one of Art's Payne 202's in the $700 range.

Thanks...I've been to Art's site before and never realized he's just 7 miles from my folk's place!

[Crocwrestler]

To the OP, I am also brand new to bamboo and pondering the same questions as you. Sounds like you are open to building your own bamboo rod, possibly having built an Epic kit in the past?

There was another recent thread on here about Proof Fly Fishings bamboo blanks. They have a Dickerson 8014 taper (8’ 5 wt), apparently made by a reputable builder in Virginia, that could be built up for right around your budget. That blank sounds like it would be a great fit for your (and mine) transition to bamboo, so I just wanted to make you aware of it.


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[Per]

I would look for a rod based on Per Brandin tapers…

So, a Brandin rod then? Or are other builders basing their rods on his tapers?

[kakaryan]

Some updates, so I am looking at blanks and tapers. Building the rod myself and I could still keep it pretty within my budget. (plus the fun of rod building during boring covid time....)

I did some research and narrow it down to these 3 tapers. How could you compare them? And what are their actual line weight when using modern plastic flylines (says a Rio Perception or SA Mastery Trout)

Dickerson 801510
Dickerson 801611
Leonard Model 50

The above two Dickerson, I read people rated them differently from as low as 4wt up to 7wt. If, I want a 5/6wt blank, fishing 5wt line when it calls for delicate trout presentation taper, and 6wt line when it calls for more aggressive taper lines for wets and smaller streamers, which one should I get? the 801510 or 801611?

Or either model, with a dry tip and a wet tip?

Then the Leonard Model 50, I read that it is slower than the Dickerson.

But how fast or slow when there tapers are comparing with graphite? Let's say maybe a "fast"(for bamboo) Dickerson, is maybe as fast as a mid fast, or medium Sage? (Z-Axis? MOD?) Then the slower Leonard maybe like a Sage Circa? Or Winston? Or maybe a CTS/Epic modern fast glass?

Without casting any, just trying to get some feel about how fast or slow they are, whe comparing to the graphite rods I know.

Thanks....

[ibookje]

My advice would be cast as many bamboo fly rods before deciding which blank or even getting a rod.
The nice thing about trying a bamboo rod you also get to talk with the owner of the rod and (s)he will tell you his thoughts about why (s)he likes the rod(s). This will certainly broaden your view on what bamboo rods are and how to appreciate them. Very possible that you'll even alter your original thoughts. Just trying (ha!) to compare them with modern graphite rods just don't cut it. It's a whole different ball game so to speak. Enjoy the journey as it's half of the fun.

[kakaryan]

Trying all of them would be the best option, but unavailable.

Not locating in the US and there are less than 10 people flyfish in my city, let alone bamboo rods with those tapers.....The only I could try casting would be one or two small stream bamboo, 3~4wt, 7' and under......quite different to what I am looking for, and those taper.

It is going to be a purchase before test cast, so I appreciate and value all of your input....

Thanks

[G-ManBart]

Trying all of them would be the best option, but unavailable.

Not locating in the US and there are less than 10 people flyfish in my city, let alone bamboo rods with those tapers.....The only I could try casting would be one or two small stream bamboo, 3~4wt, 7' and under......quite different to what I am looking for, and those taper.

It is going to be a purchase before test cast, so I appreciate and value all of your input....

Thanks

That does make things harder, but I wouldn't worry about it too much. If you stick with a rod or taper from any mainstream name it's hard to go wrong. Sure, there might be something out there that you would like better, but that doesn't mean you'll be unhappy with what you have. Honestly, the less experienced you are, the less it probably matters. The really experienced bamboo casters will notice subtle differences that they either love or hate while the rest of us don't notice them at all. I have rods from a variety of makers and tapers that are all quite different and while I notice the difference if I go back and forth between two of them, it's just not a big deal when I pick up one and cast it.

Are you leaning towards anything in particular?

[Doug K]

One thing that should be obvious, but may not be to a first time bamboo owner, is that the action or performance of bamboo rods will differ greatly even among rods of the same length and line weight.

very much this..

my first bamboo was a SB 359 8 1/2', for me it's a fine 5wt. It is relatively fast for bamboo so I don't have to adjust much at all from a Sage LL 9' 5wt.
Second was a SB 359 9' which is a 6wt, slow and easy, and it takes some thinking about. Similarly SB 323 9' which to me seems a 5/6wt.

Recently started fishing with a SB 290, 7 1/2' 5wt, and it is definitely the best of the cane I've fished. It balances well with a light CFO III, casts well from 10 feet up to 60 (which is my limit, not the rod's), just a delight.
These can be found for $300-400 in good condition, cheaper for the raddled ones. Mine was very experienced and plan to refinish it this winter..



Anything 8' or under should be relatively easy to adapt to. 9' cane does get a bit different, in my experience.

I don't use cane for the bigger carp, up to 5-6lbs is the most I've attempted.

[teter]

You state that you are building your own rod and that you have narrowed the taper choices down to to the Dickerson 801510 or 801611 and the Leonard 50, and that you would not be fishing for trout but for warm water fish including possibly carp. In that case, I would go with the 801611. The carp might be pushing it.

[PYochim]

A bit of advice to someone new to bamboo, I would not recommend one of those "cute" little 3 weights.

[kakaryan]

I am sure you will find bamboo rods are not crazy difficult slow. As mentioned above, you just need to cast bamboo.
Also, rod prices are better understood with research. Like me, you will find rods that are worth more than money.

Come back to this very thread in three months... twelve months... please do let us know your results.

So after a year I come back to this thread as a proud owner of 3 bamboo rods. I am expecting more are coming.

They didn't came mint, but I did some restoration work to them, fish them, they work and I enjoy them.

Thanks for all your valuable advice.

[Bill Moschler]

From my experience bamboo rods are less forgiving over a day of fishing than graphite rods. Bamboo seems to work well at a narrower range of distance than graphite. A bamboo rod that casts a light fly delicately is not going to push a big wet fly in a pinch. Etc. I like fishing bamboo in good conditions for the bamboo rods I have. Not so much so when not fishing the optimum conditions for that rod. Since I have limited opportunities to fish and need to optimize some trips I still fish graphite a lot. I am working on finding more versatile bamboo rods but think they will be limited. Right now working on finishing a Para 15 blank that I am hoping will the "the answer" to my "all day rod.|

[Rjg]

I have a few rods in the upper end price range. I can't say they fish any better than the rods I have in the working man's price range. Go figure.... Find one you enjoy regardless of price and enjoy it.