Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

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Gnome
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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#41

Post by Gnome »

Torzites are great guides and we have yet to understand how good they truly are. Some are much more concerned with traditional looks than performance and durability. A short story;

A rod maker was telling a group about how he had this customer who loved his rod and fished it hard in the salt for reds and he was replacing the guides every year due to the extreme wear and conditions. He told this story after a decade of replacing snake guides and yet because they do not look right he/they refuse to upgrade to a guide that will not fail the way the snakes are in that situation. Does that make sense? not to me when there are alternatives that will handle those conditions and not wear out the way the snakes are. All because "they do not look right"

Even Bamboo evolves otherwise we all would be fishing rods with hanging rings glued up with hide glue etc.. If it does not evolve it stagnates and these guides are one way of taking it forward a wee bit more.


personal experience trumps opinion so bite the bullet and buy a set and try them. Evolution of this tool is fought tooth and nail and has been for well over 150 years.

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Kleinpm
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Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#42

Post by Kleinpm »

Gnome wrote:Torzites are great guides and we have yet to understand how good they truly are. Some are much more concerned with traditional looks than performance and durability. A short story;

A rod maker was telling a group about how he had this customer who loved his rod and fished it hard in the salt for reds and he was replacing the guides every year due to the extreme wear and conditions. He told this story after a decade of replacing snake guides and yet because they do not look right he/they refuse to upgrade to a guide that will not fail the way the snakes are in that situation. Does that make sense? not to me when there are alternatives that will handle those conditions and not wear out the way the snakes are. All because "they do not look right"

Even Bamboo evolves otherwise we all would be fishing rods with hanging rings glued up with hide glue etc.. If it does not evolve it stagnates and these guides are one way of taking it forward a wee bit more.


personal experience trumps opinion so bite the bullet and buy a set and try them. Evolution of this tool is fought tooth and nail and has been for well over 150 years.
I am not doubting the effectiveness of torzite guides. I am doubting my ability to actually buy themImage.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#43

Post by Godfroy »

The smallest size Torzite guides are really tiny. I have bought a couple of size 3.5 to use as hook keepers if I ever obtain enough of the larger sizes to equip a whole rod.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#44

Post by Gnome »

Without a doubt, every rod maker owes himself or herself at least 1 rod with Torzite guides. The more I fish them the more impressive they are.

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Re: Torzite guides photos

#45

Post by Godfroy »

Tom Smithwick wrote:#6 torzite guide and tiptop. The look is certainly different, but I can get used to it on a rod designed to perform
Image

#15 duronze ferrule, #10 torzite guide. Also looks clean and efficient.
Image

They only offer a high frame stripper, the looks of that will take some getting used to, but no denying the effectiveness.
Image
The 8mm T-KWTG8 makes quite a nice low frame stripper for a light line rod.

Image

The inside diameter of this ring is 6.39 mm. For comparison, the inside diameters of the stripper rings on three of my traditional #4 weight rods are Payne 97 - 4.93 mm, Hardy Marvel - 4.2 mm and Constable Wallop Brook - 5.69 mm, so it seems more than big enough.

I imagine the 10 mm T-KWTG10 also has a low frame, as opposed to the T-KWTG10M which has a higher frame, but I have yet to get hold of one.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#46

Post by Gnome »

And the extreme drop in friction is really going to extend line life, these guides are IT!!!!!!!!!!! Love their ability to shoot line even in close situations having almost no friction is awesome!!!!

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Tom Smithwick
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Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#47

Post by Tom Smithwick »

<<<I imagine the 10 mm T-KWTG10 also has a low frame, as opposed to the T-KWTG10M which has a higher frame, but I have yet to get hold of one.>>>

I believe that is correct. I was given the wrong information. The guides with the M designation are the high frame version. In any case, I have now built 2 five weight rods using a single foot as the stripper. They work fine.
I was advised that the earlier ceramic guides lost some of their slickness if they got dirty, and therefore needed to be kept clean. I have not seen that as yet, but will be looking for it.
I built an 8 foot 5 weight bamboo rod with torzites and have had a number of good casters try both rods. Everyone can feel the slickness. I completely understand those who want to keep their rods looking traditional and won't argue the point. However there is no longer any question in my mind that Jeff is correct in his assessment of the performance of these guides. Use them or not as you see fit, but do try them if you can. I will bring my rods to the Catskills and let people make their own minds up.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#48

Post by mrampant »

I looked at the option of using the Torzite, but the hassle of finding all the sizes and the cost in Aussie dollars. I was planning on using them for a spey and the total cost for all Torzite was near on $350; is this expected?
Cheers,
Mark
He who shall not be able to make a trout fly, after studying these diagrams and directions, must be deficient either in brains or in manual dexterity. : Edward Fitzgibbon 1853

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Kleinpm
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Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#49

Post by Kleinpm »

mrampant wrote:I looked at the option of using the Torzite, but the hassle of finding all the sizes and the cost in Aussie dollars. I was planning on using them for a spey and the total cost for all Torzite was near on $350; is this expected?
Cheers,
Mark
It was going to be about 150 for an 8 foot rod about a month ago. Not sure how many guides a spey rod needs but 350 is probably about right.
Patrick Klein

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#50

Post by Gnome »

Yep, they are expensive but worth every penny if you want the highest performance you can achieve with what we know about rod building today. They are slick buggers for sure and slick like we have never seen before with a guide, R.N.Issacs would be over the moon with where Fuji has taken his original idea/patent from 1863.


good stuff and any rod maker concerned with top performance should be using these guides IMHO


The newest unmentionable SW rod from SCOTT has a Torzite stripper guide and is one of the meanest SW rods available today, light and extreme performance.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#51

Post by Pentalux »

Figure I should follow up on my initial post. Have put them on a few rods now including this TEST 868XT which has a non-glare acrylic enamel finish as well as both single and double foot Torzite guides. So far I am a huge fan of these things. They definitely add distance. The weight savings is noticeable as well - along with the cost which is a definite negative. Here are a few pic's
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#52

Post by Tommasini »

I think they are vastly overrated. I outfitted a rod with them and did not notice any difference in casting performance compared to snake guides (Snake Brand). However, they are very expensive when compared to snake guides. I won't be doing that again. Hope I didn't rain on anybody's parade.

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Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#53

Post by Pentalux »

No worries here - besides fishing's usually better in the rain - would be curious to see the two sticks though or did you strip and re-wrap as I did? Honestly would only put them on saltwater stuff myself, as initially noted, but cannot see how they wouldn't improve the performance of any rod relative to the same with a traditionally sized agate and snakes - they are about 15' longer casting than w/ oversized REC guides - for me anyway.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#54

Post by Tommasini »

I put them on a Fiberglass rod, the whole rod. I would not ever put them on Bamboo, they look to futuristic but that's me, I'm a bit of a traditionalist. Maybe if the Torzite Ring was mounted in a traditional frame , that would be OK.
I bought them from an English supplier (forget which one) , price with shipping was much cheaper than the States. I remember seeing a chart on the supplier's website that showed the lowest drag coefficient belonged to Snake Guides followed by Torzite Guides , Silicone Carbide, etc.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#55

Post by DUCKMANNM »

I've done a few wraps using single foot guides, they're not real fun to wrap, especially for arthritic old fingers, so if no one wants to talk about them on the forum, it's fine with me! Just Sayin'!

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Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#56

Post by Pentalux »

Got it - message received - you don't want to talk about them which is OK and fine by me but personally do not understand why post up about - why not just leave it alone(?) but hey that is what people seam to do here so, as stated, got it.

For those who might be interested in Torzite guides, It should be noted that there are fakes out there at this point as I ordered a set from an overseas distributor found on fleabay and received what were similar looking guides but placed next to the real thing, it was very obvious to see that they were not genuine. Came sealed in Fuji packaging (which the real ones do not). Shape was correct but the metal itself and the "Torzite" stamping on the guides themselves was not the same (fakes were stamped Fuji)- the rings looking to be a basic plastic - color was off. I did confirm that the order was correct with supplier (and then promptly cancelled a much larger order).

I am curious to check out the chart that shows snake guides having a lower coefficient than the guides stated - please direct or post link as would definitely add credibility to using Torzite for the stripper and then running snakes... Thanks!

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#57

Post by Tommasini »

I don't care about talking about them. It's just a pain going back (Aug 14) in the email to look them up. They shipped fast , no financial interest. No charge for doing the fingerwork:)The website is Guidesnblanks.com
I looked around a bit on this site for the guide comparison but didn't find. I searched Torzite Guides and that's how I found this site and several others.
Let me know if they appear to be selling fakes.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#58

Post by Gnome »

To cast a rod with torzites and say you can not feel the difference is toatally astounding to me. Every person that has cast the 7' flat lam prototype with both the SIC and the torzites has noticed a remarkable diufference. Tom Smithwick has had a fair number of guys cast multiple different rods with the Torzites and without fail every person has said wow what a difference. If you dont want to talk about them maybe not post on a thread about them? Sorry that you dont seee the benefit of the guides but does that mean everyone else has to ignore them???? sad sate of affairs for sure.,

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#59

Post by Tommasini »

I guess one has to agree with everyone to post on this thread.
Sorry for raining on your parade.

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Re: Re: Torzite guides/Titan scrim?/Censoring Moderator

#60

Post by Gnome »

A bump for this thread because proofflyfishing now has a Chinese version that as far as the ring goes they are equivalent to the Fuji Torzite but they lack the high quality of finish in the metalwork of the Fuji's but at a price point equal to the SiC, cost is no longer a factor and if you want top performance and the ability to rub the graphite boys noses in it with a bamboo rod it is time to start building rods with ceramic nitride guides. Thank you Matt!!!

And there was a man who fished Argentina last December and if he had not re-guided a rod with the Torzites his trip would have been much less successful!! because the rod he re-guided with the Torzites was capable of long cast into very hard and high speed sustained winds and higher gusts yet the beast with Torzites was capable of casting far into a 30+MPH wind with much higher speed gusts (The other rods just did not perform at the level of the Torzite guided rod purely due to type of guide used), He does frequent this forum and he is or was a hard core traditionalist and yet he now has much to chew over as far as rod performance goes, all because he was open minded enough to give them a try and had a very successful trip because of re-guiding that rod with "gasp the horrors of single foot ceramic lined guides;-) ".

edited to change knock off to version of sorry Matt
Last edited by Gnome on 03/17/20 08:01, edited 2 times in total.

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