Show us your silk gut leaders

or however that dang word is written! : ) Use this forum to discuss those things that are related to, directly, or indirectly, fly fishing, i.e., tackle, catalogs, single malt scotch, cigar preferences, pipes, camera gear, etc. This is sort of an off topic area but one related to bamboo and fly fishing.

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NewUtahCaneAngler
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Show us your silk gut leaders

#1

Post by NewUtahCaneAngler »

Here is a photo of an early Pflueger silk gut leader package that I gifted to a (sadly now former) board member for being so generous in sharing his knowledge on this forum. In hind sight, I should have sent him an invoice as his great photos and knowledge led me to needlessly invest hundreds, if not thousands in reels. I'm sure that many will be able to guess who that might be ;-)

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Please share photos of yours that you may have. Thank you and stay well!
Joe
Last edited by NewUtahCaneAngler on 01/31/21 19:19, edited 1 time in total.

60InchDV8
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Re: Show us your silk gut leader

#2

Post by 60InchDV8 »

I have some Hardy tapered silkworm gut trout and salmon leaders dateing from 1938. I also have their boxes, and a copper and a Neroda damping case with felt pads to keep them moist and supple for fishing.

I’ve fished them with silk lines and found them to be superior to mono or floro, and so did a few trout. When soaked and kept moist with the dampened felt pads, the gut leaders were translucent with no sheen, very supple, and floated under the surface meniscus. My knots were easy to tie and to adjust when tightening. The softer knotted gut seemed to grip better than stiffer harder mono or floro. The only only negatives involved in my nostalgic dry fly angling with these gut leaders was their additional care on a sunny morning as the moistened tippets can dry out while prospecting down stream or walking to another pool. I usually had to make a couple of roll casts to resoak the tippet which is a good idea anyway to calm your nerves before casting.

A wiley trout prefers a leader, mono or gut, to be presented and served “al dente”.

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NewUtahCaneAngler
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#3

Post by NewUtahCaneAngler »

Got to love the Hardy medallioned Wheatley copper leader damping case. I have not seen one in person, but did notice one a few months ago on e-Bay as part of a small bundle.

samsonboi
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#4

Post by samsonboi »

I have a bunch of those Hardy leaders, plus a Wm. Mills leader pair and a Paul H. Young leader.
"Car ce n'est pas assez d'avoir l'esprit bon, mais le principal est de l'appliquer bien.”- Descartes

60InchDV8
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#5

Post by 60InchDV8 »

Hardy and other makers also made some black japanned Dampers but these were prone to rust with prolonged use during a fishing trip. The transparent gut could colour and so discerning anglers preferred copper or the later bakelite Neroda dampers which were non corrosive.

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Last edited by 60InchDV8 on 03/29/20 02:17, edited 1 time in total.

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dshx
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#6

Post by dshx »

I saved this package from my uncle’s tackle bag. I have no intention of using it but can’t seem to let it go.
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-Dwight

jvh
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#7

Post by jvh »

This is the only one I have.

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Vern

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Greg Reynolds
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#8

Post by Greg Reynolds »

Nice post. Love the vintage packaging--they're all beautiful.

60InchDV8
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#9

Post by 60InchDV8 »

Spanish Silkworm gut leaders were considered the finest available. They replaced horse hair braided leaders, and eyes or snelled flies.

Here is an 1800 era English salmon fly with a snelled horse hair looped leader. These early flies were tied with common barnyard hackle and wings. They often had dyed “pigs wool” bodies in red, yellow, or blue. These early salmon flies predated the Victorian feather trade and silk floss was too dear as a tying material. This example has some silver wire ribbing which is extravagant for the period.

If anyone can suggest a pattern this fly resembles I would appreciate your suggestion.
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NewUtahCaneAngler
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#10

Post by NewUtahCaneAngler »

60InchDV8 wrote:Spanish Silkworm gut leaders were considered the finest available. They replaced horse hair braided leaders, and eyes or snelled flies.

Here is an 1800 era English salmon fly with a snelled horse hair looped leader. These early flies were tied with common barnyard hackle and wings. They often had dyed “pigs wool” bodies in red, yellow, or blue. These early salmon flies predated the Victorian feather trade and silk floss was too dear as a tying material. This example has some silver wire ribbing which is extravagant for the period.

If anyone can suggest a pattern this fly resembles I would appreciate your suggestion.
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:wave now that is cool!

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dshx
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#11

Post by dshx »

I always loved the description of the process by which the gut leaders were made (from a quoted text in an AMFF journal - sorry, don’t recall the original source):

"Their first step is to free the gut from such portions of the ruptured envelope as may adhere to it. Formerly this was done by drawing the gut between the teeth, and thus stripping off this refuse, but chemical processes are said now largely to have superseded this. The eyewitness, to whom I am indebted for this information, describes the old method as a most disgusting spectacle. The rows of women and girls drawing the entrails of this caterpillar through their teeth, their mouths smeared with blood from the cuts inflicted by the thin gut, mingled with the offal scraped from it by their teeth — spitting and drawing, and spitting again — must indeed be far from a pleasant sight."


-Dwight

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Flykuni3
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#12

Post by Flykuni3 »

Will get back on this thread coz I have a ton. I hv some errands today, but will take pics and mount them when I get back tonight.

I collected them for years and lots of lure guys sold them for cheap, some just gave them to me. No one wanted them. I collected points, leaders, gut-snelled flies, eyed and eyeless. I have them from the fine Hardys, pre and post King George, to local stores in LA, some from tackle shops on a piece of paper, hand-written.

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Flyman615
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#13

Post by Flyman615 »

Here are a few that found their way to me over the years
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Scott
Flyman615

"An undisturbed river is as perfect as we will ever know, every refractive slide of cold water a glimpse of eternity" - Thomas McGuane

NewUtahCaneAngler
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#14

Post by NewUtahCaneAngler »

Nice display, Scott. I especially like the one in the middle with the colorful fish.
Last edited by NewUtahCaneAngler on 04/01/20 06:42, edited 1 time in total.

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Flykuni3
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#15

Post by Flykuni3 »

Some quick shots of my guts, so to speak, apologies for the bad photos and messy post:

H&I tin, they always had nice graphics on this stuff:

[url=https://postimg.cc/WqsvTjsF][img]h ... .jpg[/img]
Braided gut.
Image[/url

Japanese examples, cool verbiage.

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[url=https://postimg.cc/ykvV6JgV][img]h ... .jpg[/img][/url]

[urlImage][/url]

[urlImage][/url]

[/[url=https://postimg.cc/ctTNJjJD][img ... .jpg[/img]url]

[url=https://postimg.cc/XrqCcGTJ][img]h ... .jpg[/img][/url]

I guess our leaders and tippets and general-to-specialized flyfishing lines would astound the old fishers.

Gimmeslack
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#16

Post by Gimmeslack »

I can't believe how cool this whole thread is :-)
I knew *nothing* about vintage leaders! Thanks all for posting and OP for kicking it off!!

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Vintagestick
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#17

Post by Vintagestick »

Joe, great post! Great opportunity to distract myself for a few minutes.

Here are several gut casts from my small collection. I have several more that are unpackaged that fill many of my cast boxes but these are the ones still in original packaging.

Wright & McGill Co.
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Horrocks & Ibboston Co.
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Alex Martin
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National Brand Tackle
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And of course I had to include a photo of some cast boxes from Richard Wheatley, Allcocks, Farlow, and Bill DeWitt.
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-Rich

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cwfly
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#18

Post by cwfly »

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NewUtahCaneAngler
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#19

Post by NewUtahCaneAngler »

Here are 3 more that I just picked up for little money, plus what appears to be a very early nylon leader if the 1951 written in the corner is accurate. I suspect that the original owner wrote the dates that (s)he purchased these.

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Keep them coming folks
Last edited by NewUtahCaneAngler on 01/31/21 19:26, edited 1 time in total.

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roycestearns
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Re: Show us your silk gut leaders

#20

Post by roycestearns »

Did you mean "Got gut?" / I'm not gutless.
Reproducing early American flies required gut, so I gobbled up any available for snells and twisted gut eyes.
The gut in front is what the tackle houses received when they ordered gut to make snells and leaders and flies.
I've fished it and it works good. The question I always had was, what kind of patience was required when the angler arrived at his spot, with fish rising, he had to untangle his soaking leader apply point and dropper flies, and then wait while his snells or gutted eyes soaked, before making his first cast. If he was not patient enough the first cast would snap off one or two flies.

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