Recent Theodore Gordon book

[creakycane]

The American Fly Fishing Experience: Theodore Gordon: His Lost Flies and Last Sentiments
by John Gubbins Oct 2019 on amazon
I haven't read it yet, it is enroute from amazon, but it was listed as a novel. The ads imply it fills in some of the blank spots in our knowledge about Gordon, but hard to say how much is creative non-fiction and how much is new information. FYI. Anyone read it yet?

[jim royston]

Not to be misanthropic, but after reading his letters and previous bios, who would want to know more about this poor soul?

[Caneghost]

First I have heard of it but I am curious too. I though McDonald had unearthed about all of the information available back in the 40's. By all means let us know what you think after you read it.

[bob2935]

I'm afraid of this one already and as you know Creaky I like you love fishing books. How can you possibly get new information on Theodore Gordon's life at this point. The premise in itself sounds ridiculous.

Bohemian Bob

[cwfly]

I have not read Mr. Gubbins book but can advise that some of the earlier information in print about Gordon is incorrect and some details of his life and background were not reported.

[jeffkn1]

It was a revelation to me to hear that the Grand Canyon didn't change by constant erosion in trickling increments, but rather in bigger chunks as a result of gully washers. I think there's a parallel to that in research today.
Generally speaking, the history of American fishing is pretty low in attraction to younger generations than my own and that's both good and bad. It's bad because the repositories for a lot of it are overlooked when people die. That's why I see it end up in estate auctions and flea markets where I try to find more pieces to fit into the history puzzle. The upside today is that sometimes very critical information collected by those who have gone before is donated to libraries, universities, and historical societies, and sometimes gets preserved in digital format. The Daniel Fearing collection, for example, was amassed by a man with endless curiosity about fishing, particularly for cold water species. Little by little it has been finding its way onto the internet. That's ongoing worldwide constantly. The only limiting factor is how much manpower is available at any given time to do the grunt work of scanning. Manpower equates dollars. Yale has deep pockets, your local historical society not so much.
So, just as the canyons erode in chunks, information can come online in the same fashion. And crazy people, cwfly and myself being typical, are like pigs in a wallow when a source of new information comes online. It's now to the point where new books about fishing history are rarely current for more than a matter of months. It was once years. All it takes is a curious mind, the time to explore, and a foot in the door of some newly revealed information. Now you can go more often to primary sources instead of citing other 20th century fishing books. Charlie knows more information about Gordon than most people. He's peeled back some of the layers and that's why we keep nudging him to write.
Whether Mr. Gubbins has availed himself of all the same sources that Charlie has remains to be seen. Rest assured that what we have read about Theodore Gordon up to this point is not the whole story.
And that goes for everything.

[bluesjay]

Hi Guys, Theodore Gordon is one of the most interesting of our anglers. Why wouldn't we want more evidence? Why wouldn't we want more testimony?

Jay Edwards

[bob2935]

Believe me if there is one tidbit of new information on Gordon I am sure I will buy the book. He appeared be a dark brooding character. My kinda guy. All those pro fly tiers are nuts.

Bohemian Bob

[ibookje]

Good thing I stopped after my first order
Made something fun into work. Wasn't my cup of tea.

My kinda guy. All those pro fly tiers are nuts.

[Woodlakejag]

I’m enjoying this book. It’s historical fiction and the author does a good job of basing it in fact and filling in the spaces with fiction. It’s well grounded in history and fishing, with some imagination mixed in. I recommend it.

[jeffkn1]

I’m enjoying this book. It’s historical fiction and the author does a good job of basing it in fact and filling in the spaces with fiction. It’s well grounded in history and fishing, with some imagination mixed in. I recommend it.

Is it written in a manner that would allow a reader unfamiliar with Gordon to understand what parts are fact and what parts fiction?

[ted patlen]

I'm confused; is it historical fiction? Is there a bibliography?

[roycestearns]

"Historical fiction" is a very interesting phrase. Hopefully no one uses it as source.

[cwfly]

An interview with the author my be found here:

https://www.wnmufm.org/post/interview-j ... e#stream/0

[bob2935]

Historical fiction? The concept sounds crazy. Is this style of literature common? Seems like a contradiction then again what do I know.

Bohemian Bob

[crowebeetle]

Historical fiction is a genre that has been around a long time. My issue with it is that one takes historical events and adds fictional elements and unless one knows the history quite well the fiction will get incorporated into the historical legacy if you cannot separate the two. Since I know little about TG and I read the book, I wouldn't be able to discriminate between fact and fiction.

[jeffkn1]

Historical fiction is a genre that has been around a long time. My issue with it is that one takes historical events and adds fictional elements and unless one knows the history quite well the fiction will get incorporated into the historical legacy if you cannot separate the two. Since I know little about TG and I read the book, I wouldn't be able to discriminate between fact and fiction.

Bingo.
Kenneth Roberts wrote historical novels, in which the protagonists were fictional. Here the protagonist is a known historical figure and his thoughts and actions are fiction. It may scratch someone's itch but it does nothing to advance the study of an important figure and I suspect that that was his real aim when he started out.

[creakycane]

I think it is hard to say whether it should be classified as historical fiction or creative nonfiction. Since TG did exist, and many of the major places and events are accurate, it's not clear to me that the book would be classified as fiction. But, I am not sure whether all the fine details of fishing companions, fly patterns used at particular times, medical conditions, etc. are speculative or realistic? - if they are imaginative, it is hard to classify as non-fiction.

One thing for sure: while it may be a very enjoyable, interesting book, it is not a well sourced academic research work where one could run and explore facts further. But it does not claim to be...... There are lots of interesting books, even great books, that would not pass peer review for a historically-accurate press.

The author discloses that the relationship with the romantic partner described, and his relationship with the Henderson's, required imaginative details. As far as the "Lost Flies" mentioned in the subtitle, I am not sure. "Dinner with LaBranche and Hewitt"? The author does claim that he has written "TG's own story about himself". I really have to read the book thoroughly someday; alas, I just looked at it enough to decide to keep it, but it is still in the inbox!

For those asking about the bibliography, some typical Catskill/Gordon book are mentioned - McDonald, Sparse, Austin Francis, Van Put, Wright, Larry Solomon Eric Leiser - even boardmember Eric (Peper)'s work on the Beaverkill in collaboration with Gary LaFontaine is mentioned in the brief reference list. So pretty standard, but good refs. The one I had to look up was a book on "Loomis" (no, not graphite, no need to ban me!), but the sanitarium in the Catskills and/or Liberty, that must have provided some input to the book. Anyway, that was the only reference unknown to me, but perhaps boardmembers may know it - they would largely know the rest of the list.

[cwfly]

I have not read Mr. Gubbins book but I assume the reference to Loomis was to the Loomis Sanatorium which was constructed and opened in Liberty, Sullivan County, New York in 1896. It housed patients and I know of no evidence that Gordon was ever a patient residing in the facility. I know that in May of 1892 his mother in Savannah, Georgia, “Mrs. Gordon, who is the mother of the well known broker, Theodore Gordon, has been seriously ill for several months, and goes north on the advice of her physicians.” I further know that on July 9, 1892 Theodore Gordon left Savannah “for Sullivan County, New York … where his mother, who went north after a long illness is trying to recuperate. Mrs. Gordon’s condition causes her family grave anxiety. Mr. Gordon will probably be away a month.” It turns out he did not return to Savannah until November of 1892.
There are two things learned from this. Mrs. Gordon, although removed to Sullivan County from Georgia for her health on the advice of her doctors was not treated at the Loomis Sanatorium since it did not exist. And it could be inferred that if she was being treated for tuberculosis (consumption) her son Theodore might have caught it from her.

[ted patlen]

Historical fiction is a genre that has been around a long time. My issue with it is that one takes historical events and adds fictional elements and unless one knows the history quite well the fiction will get incorporated into the historical legacy if you cannot separate the two. Since I know little about TG and I read the book, I wouldn't be able to discriminate between fact and fiction.

Yes that was understood.I thought I used an exclamation mark. Just wondering if there was a bibliography ...