Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

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gooseberryrods
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Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#1

Post by gooseberryrods »

Recently acquired this sweet little Orvis from a forum member. 7 1/2’, 3/2, all original and in excellent condition. Weighing in at a svelte 3.3 ounces. I love it with a modern DT-3 but am anxious to try a 4 weight silk.
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thegubster
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#2

Post by thegubster »

Hmmm, nice little pickup Scott. I hope she serves you well.

If I didn't have enough 7 1/2 ft'ers already I'd be after you to put me on your list should you decide to part with her but for as much as I fish these days it would be a travesty!! I like 3 pc light-liners...

Please share how she fares for you with the 4wt line compared to the 3wt. sometime, it'd be interesting. Now go out and enjoy it...

Jeremy.

Bill T
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#3

Post by Bill T »

Beautiful rod. I like the varnished Orvis rods. Was that when Omar Needham was working at Orvis?

gooseberryrods
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#4

Post by gooseberryrods »

Bill T wrote:Beautiful rod. I like the varnished Orvis rods. Was that when Omar Needham was working at Orvis?
That’s a good question Bill. I believe Wes Jordan sourced rods and workers to meet whatever demands he had at the time the rod was made, which was of course during our countries early involvement in WW2 when materials and manpower were in short supply. Not sure when Omar Needham arrived at Orvis but it was likely close to the time the rod was made. The previous owner, an author and professional rod maker, told me he thinks it was made by Pinky Gillum and that the ferrules were made by Halstead.
Last edited by gooseberryrods on 05/23/20 22:25, edited 1 time in total.

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Flyman615
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#5

Post by Flyman615 »

A very nice example of my very favorite Orvis era. I happen to have #0182 and #0250 from the same time frame. Lovely varnished rods!

Scott Z.
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Fanwing
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#6

Post by Fanwing »

Very nice!
It looks to be in great condition.
Those signature wraps look farmiliar.

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Last edited by Fanwing on 05/26/20 17:04, edited 1 time in total.

rsagebrush
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#7

Post by rsagebrush »

very cool!

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roycestearns
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#8

Post by roycestearns »

Exceptional rod! I too believe this was a sweet spot in the Orvis rod history. These are Wes Jordan's tapers developed from his experience at Cross and SB. Now he has been influenced by Gillum and Halstead, how much better can it get. This is like a Kosmic maker lineup rod.
Not sure when Omar Needham arrived at Orvis but it was likely close to the time the rod was made.
Omar was at the rod shop before Jordan arrived, doing varnishing for what little Orvis was producing at the time, and making his own "Needham manchester" rods. Omar was very respected for his brushed varnish work, but less so for his tapers .

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Short Tip
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#9

Post by Short Tip »

gooseberryrods wrote: The previous owner, an author and professional rod maker, told me he thinks it was made by Pinky Gillum and that the ferrules were made by Halstead.
I love this rod, it's a great emblem of the renewal at Orvis in this era. I owned a similar rod years ago and enjoyed it.

Per the Orvis database, Halstead came to Orvis in '45, and Gillum in '46. I can't imagine Halstead having anything to do with those ferrules, as his designs never used waisting as seen in these. I don't know if Halstead had any input into the later, more modern Orvis ferrules, or if he was just a shophand.

gooseberryrods
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#10

Post by gooseberryrods »

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0104/ ... 1571438555

I know having owned the 6’ Orvis Battenkill (0460), that Halstead ferrules were used on that rod (see above). I have seen some oddities on original Halstead rods including neck down ferrules on a 7 1/2’ rod that looked like Montague ferrules until you closely examined them and realized they were Halstead’s work. I would say I have never seen waisted ferrules on a Halstead rod so it would be interesting to learn if the ferrules on the 0129 rod were Jordan’s design or?

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roycestearns
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#11

Post by roycestearns »

The large vase like welt and waisted ferrules are not something that Wes did at Cross, SB, or earlier Orvis, and not what Omar did on his Manchester rods.

gooseberryrods
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#12

Post by gooseberryrods »

roycestearns wrote:The large vase like welt and waisted ferrules are not something that Wes did at Cross, SB, or earlier Orvis, and not what Omar did on his Manchester rods.
Royce- do you know who made waisted ferrules? Did Payne ever use them?

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Short Tip
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#13

Post by Short Tip »

Payne used waisted ferrules in the pre-Halstead years. Halstead ferrules eliminated the "waist". That's one reason it seemed unlikely to me that Halstead made these ferrules. Is it possible that Jordan sourced these ferrules from Montague, since Orvis had a business relationship with them at the time?

gooseberryrods
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#14

Post by gooseberryrods »

Short Tip wrote:Payne used waisted ferrules in the pre-Halstead years. Halstead ferrules eliminated the "waist". That's one reason it seemed unlikely to me that Halstead made these ferrules. Is it possible that Jordan sourced these ferrules from Montague, since Orvis had a business relationship with them at the time?
Short Tip- Have you seen Montague ferrules that resemble the ferrules we are discussing? The best quality Monty ferrules I’ve seen look nothing like the ones we are discussing.

Just for educational purposes, I have included a picture of Halstead ferrules from http://i446.photobucket.com/albums/qq18 ... ead005.jpg a rod I once owned. These are the only time I have seen these ferrules.

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Short Tip
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#15

Post by Short Tip »

No, I'm not that familiar with Montague ferrules so I base that SWAG on the timeframe of the rod. Just shooting in the dark here. Those Halstead ferrules you picture are pretty wild! I wonder why he chose that style. Here's a late era Halstead rod and its ferrules. As a side note, I have to say that the taper of this rod, a 7' 2/2, seemed to owe more to Wes Jordan than to Jim Payne. It made me wonder whether Jordan had an influence on Halstead's taper design during his brief stint at Orvis. Other Halstead rods I've examined and cast seemed more solidly in the Catskill tradition.

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eastprong
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#16

Post by eastprong »

They are certainly not Montague ferrules as the Orvis-Montague business arrangement was post-war.

I have 15 rods from the 1941-45 era and it's rare to find a sliding band seat on them, so nice going Goosie!

--Rich

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roycestearns
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Re: Orvis Rod from ‘41-42.

#17

Post by roycestearns »

Here are the ferrules from Bruce H's Orvis Montague rod .
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And it appears that both FET and EP used waisted ferrules early on
viewtopic.php?f=64&t=50659&p=769469&hil ... ed#p769469

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