ID a crusty 8'-ish 3/2 drop ring fly rod

[ctwhite]

The rod was gifted to me in its form case. There were (now removed) remnants of very, very fine wire that tell me it was a wall-hanger at some point. It's a relic, for sure.

I'm interested in knowing who made the rod. It's value, not so much.

There are no markings. Not anywhere. Not a letter, not a number. Nothing. Trust me. I pseudo cleaned the butt cap thinking I might find something under the grunge. I did not.

The rod currently measures 8' but the short mid section has me thinking its length could be 8' 2". Other than the short mid, all sections are intact - all the drop ring guides are there, all the wraps, too. The wraps are scarlet red. There is no keeper nor any evidence of one previously. If there was writing on the rod blank it was absorbed into the alligatored varnish a long time ago. With a lifetime in woodworking I recognize the reel seat as Butternut. The tips are impossibly thin. By it's color and weight, I'm guessing the form case is white pine or cedar. There are remnants of cotton ties under domed brass tacks on the case. There is no sock. Clearly no tube.

It's an enigma, wrapped in a riddle, covered in grunge...

IMG_4585 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4575 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4580 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4574 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4570 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4565 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4561 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4545 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4543 by Craig White, on Flickr

[Bamboocollector#1]

I believe you have an early Chubb.

[16parachuteadams]

An interesting and apparently well-built early rod. No idea who made it. I do find the knurling of reelseat hardware and ferrules interesting and unusual. Hope you find more info on this.

[steeliefool]

Do the slid rings and ferrules clean up like the butt cap ? And, what's the transition from reel seat to cork look like ?
Thanks.

[TheMontyMan]

There are a few traits on this rod that lead me to believe that it might have been built by the Thomas H. Chubb Rod Company.

• 1. I've seen similar reel seat band styling on Chubb rods with wooden reel seats. Both bands are basically the same part, making mass production a bit easier.
  2. The knurling pattern on both the sliding bands and the female ferrules are similar. I've seen a similar knurling pattern on Chubb rods.
  3. It appears that this rod does not have a metal winding check, but is wrapped over the top of the cork grip. Most of Chubb's earlier fly rods did not have a metal winding check. Silk thread was wrapped from the cane up and over the end of the cork grip. This styling (without a metal winding check) continued on many of their fly rods up until the closing of the shop in the early 1930's.

Positive identification becomes pretty difficult when you consider these things:

• 1. Most rods built by Chubb were sold as trade rods and were not marked with the maker's name.
  2. Chubb sold its hardware and cane to the general public and to other rod builders.
  3. Even when sold to the public directly, only their highest quality rods were marked with the Chubb logo.

I'll see if I can dig out a marked Chubb rod or two with some of these this style traits to compare.

. . . Rex
The Monty Man

[Tom Smithwick]

Question for the OP on the very fine wire that was attached. Was that just attached in a couple places, or was it wrapped on the shaft in a spiral type pattern?

[ctwhite]

First, thank you for the help...

The fine wire: Absolutely left-overs from wall hanging. Bits on the ring guides, bits on the shaft, all of it lining up nicely from section to section.

The ferules, tip-tops, slide rings all clean up to match the butt cap. All of which are secured with pins. The transition from reel seat to cork is simply a fixed slide ring.

And correct, there is no metal winding check, just wraps from the cane up onto the cork.

IMG_4632 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4636 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_4627 by Craig White, on Flickr

[TheMontyMan]

Wow! The reel seat bands and ferrules cleaned up nicely. From the original pictures, I would have thought the reel seat bands would have been solid brass. Nice job! How did you clean them?

. . . Rex
The Monty Man

[bluesjay]

Hi Guys, Wow! A pinned tip top! Very cool rod.....

Jay Edwards

[Flykuni3]

I’d compare to my Chubb 8’ lancewood but Gnome’s working on it.

[ctwhite]

Wow! The reel seat bands and ferrules cleaned up nicely. From the original pictures, I would have thought the reel seat bands would have been solid brass. Nice job! How did you clean them?

. . . Rex
The Monty Man

FPE mineral spirits on a pad loosened the environmental grunge (woodsmoke and nicotine, I think) and a polishing cloth did the rest. (Fine Paints of Europe)

[ctwhite]

7A6C2257-38C5-4F36-9E8A-CEAB67AE9814 by Craig White, on Flickr

IMG_5013 by Craig White, on Flickr

Coming along nicely. The finish was shellac which was easily removed without causing harm to the wraps. All the nickel bits are shiny again. A little more gentle cleaning to do then it will get varnished (just a cosmetic coat). I love the idea of fishing this rod - even if only once - but it's probably destined for a wall display. As a fly rod, it' an absolute noodle...

[Dwight]

I’m astonished at how well you cleaned up that rod while leaving the wraps and rings intact. The rod looks truly amazing, nice work! I agree that you must fish that rod at least once. Who knows, maybe you’ll fall for the slow action.

[jeffkn1]

Hi Guys, Wow! A pinned tip top! Very cool rod.....

Jay

I don't think they're pinned, I think they're staked with a fine, pointed punch. Wheeler staked his tip tops and I think I have seen it done by other makers as well. It seems to have been more of a 19th century approach.

Dwight

The early Chubb finishes were really thin and of inferior quality. It's an old joke about early Porsche cars (356 series) that if you put them in the garage and close the door, you can hear them rust by listening very carefully. The same applies to many early Chubbs, where if you sit in a quiet room with one you can hear the finish flake and fall off, while the dry wraps crack and leap off the rod; you could see it age from day to day.
They are the easiest rods to strip. The OP's rod, maybe 1910-1920(?), is wrapped somewhat better than its predecessors so the wraps can be salvaged but the finish comes off with no problem.
And God bless NS, it makes every restorationist look like a jeweler.

[ctwhite]

I don't think they're pinned, I think they're staked with a fine, pointed punch.

That's correct.

And shellac is an easy finish to work with. Certainly easy to remove when it's ancient and degraded...

[bluesjay]

Hi Guys, Well, I'm glad the tip tops aren't pinned. I tend to pin, and this lets me off the hook.

Jay Edwards